Leadership Voyage

S4E19: Find Your Superpower Through Unconditional Values, With Andy Crocker

• Season 4 • Episode 19

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Andy Crocker is an aerospace executive with three decades of experience across human and robotic exploration, hypersonics, and missile defense. He’s held senior roles at several companies, leading the development of innovative technologies and managing complex system programs for NASA, commercial, and Department of Defense customers. As a strategic leader, he’s built high-performance teams and contributed to some of the most ambitious projects in aerospace, including NASA’s Human Landing System. He’s been inducted as a Technical Fellow at a global, Fortune 300 company and an Associate Fellow of the American Institute of Aeronautics and Astronautics. He holds undergraduate and graduate degrees in engineering, humanities, management, and leadership. This multidisciplinary educational background and diverse career shaped his perspective that led to The Unconditionals, in which he reveals the foundational, timeless values that help readers unlock the potential for their greatest personal and professional fulfillment.

  • Andy was inspired to write his book "The Unconditionals" earlier in life, but did it when 1) his oldest son was a senior in high school, 2) he finished 3rd in the space race with Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos, and 3) he reached midlife and wanted to share wisdom.
  • Failure in his human landing project led to the realization that failure is okay, and that's where growth happens.
  • Our challenges aren't unique today; we can find comfort and leverage timeless wisdom
  • The 5 unconditional values are: Love, Gratitude, Integrity, Accountability, and Endeavor. 
    • Love applies in the workplace because you want to treat all humans around you with respect
      • you have an infinite supply
    • Gratitude often goes wrong because of either worry (future) or complaint (past)
    • Integrity comes from the word integer and implies "whole," it's more than honesty
    • The path to ACCOuntability is ACCO (Acknowledge, Consequences, Complete, Own)
    • Endeavor requires Effort, Purpose, Attitude, and Growth
      • Failure is a stepping stone to success, it's not a roadblock
    • Superpower is standing out from who you were, just start by taking one step to embrace these unconditional values and align yourself with it

Leadership Voyage is brought to you by Golden Mean Consulting Group, specializing in the training of new managers.

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Did you know that up to 82% of new managers are left completely in the dark, untrained and searching for answers? That lack of preparation doesn't just hurt your new leaders, it holds your entire business back, draining morale and costing you productivity. Stop the clock on bad management. Golden Mean Consulting offers a proven no fluff approach to help your new managers build the right habits from day one. Our co-founders Sonia and Jason have over 20 years of experience in the trenches, so you can trust they know what works. To learn more, visit golden means consulting.com. That's g o ldemeultinggroup.com. Wherever you are on your leadership voyage, it starts here.[Music][Music] Hey everybody, welcome back to another episode of Leadership Voyage, the podcast dedicated to your pursuit of becoming a great leader. I'm your host, Jason Wick, and today we've got a really good discussion for you um with Andy Crocker. He is uh an interesting guy because he is a rocket scientist. I love saying that. I don't know why. He is a rocket scientist. He finished third place in the space race with uh loss just to Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos. So there's your marketing line if you were interested in what this all means. He's dedicated five years to um human landing project of getting someone on the moon and working with NASA and winning that project, but they finished in third. They did not get it. And that was one of the catalysts among a couple of other things that inspired him to write this book which is um about called the unconditionals and you will see what that's all about. Uh if you are listening to the show on Spotify, Apple podcast or elsewhere, please subscribe. If you're just listening but don't follow the show, that would be wonderful. It helps spread the word. Uh and the mission of the show is helping as many folks sharpen their leadership skills as possible. Uh, you can contact me anytime you want. Jason Wickstartyouvoyaggmail.com. Uh, feel free to email me. Please don't be shy. A lot of folks have been contacting me with show ideas or getting people onto the podcast. So, don't feel like uh don't feel deterred. Don't be intimidated. Just send me something. What do you think? Did you like this about the show? Did you not like this show? Didn't like this guest? Didn't like this question? I'm happy to hear it. But anyway, let's get to the interview. Uh again, Andy Crocker, rocket scientist, author, and uh an all-around very thoughtful human being. I think you're going to enjoy this conversation about his book, The Unconditionals, here on season 4 of Leadership Voyage.[Music] All right, everybody. Welcome back to another episode of Leadership Voyage. I am very happy to be joined today by Andy Crocker. Andy, it's nice to see you today. Good to see you. Thanks for having me. And thanks for joining from Huntsville. I've not been there yet, but it sounds like a warm place this time of year. Is that true? Yes. Too warm right now. Yeah. Warm and humid. It's one of those where you get up in the morning and it's already just uh too hot and humid to walk outside. So, uh can't wait for the fall. Okay, good. Yeah, I'm in Colorado, so a little drier. Still get the we get the 90s, but uh thankfully uh not too warm to walk outside in the morning. So, I'm thankful for that. Uh well, we're here today um to talk about your your new book um and some of the content that lies within. And I'm I'm sure whoever you talk to, they they find a way to make a joke about rocket science. Um but I just want to let everyone know. So this is the opportunity where you can actually have a conversation and and hear a rocket scientist which is which is really funny and fun. So thank you for that. Uh your book is the unconditionals five timeless values to live without limits and ignite your superpower. And the reason that the uh rocket science piece becomes relevant here is kind of part of what you open this book with around a particular ambition you had and and a failure that you've had. Would you mind sharing that with us a little bit? I'd love to. I I had started thinking about writing down what became the book a long time ago. When I first started having kids, I I decided I wanted to write down eventually write down things that I thought were important for them to know. And you know, you always hope that you teach those things and in the process of of raising your kids, but but I wanted to make sure that I convey those things and do it in writing. But, you know, you start with the best of intentions and and you you realize that, oh, I'm running out of time. And so when my when my son uh became a senior in high school, it hit me and I realized, wow, I've got to I got to really get on this. But what made it particularly um impactful to me and I think really what shaped the book in in in several ways is that uh just about the same time, just a couple of months before uh I started the book, I had reached the end of a major project. And as you said, it was a it was a a great opportunity for an aerospace engineer, rocket scientist. I was leading a team to try to develop the next human landing system, which is just what it sounds like. It's it's the the vehicle that will take humans to the moon. and uh the company I was working for, we I kind of led the charge to get us involved and and we progressed and ended up competing with Elon Musk's SpaceX and Jeff Bezos's Blue Origin. So, it was our company and those two that were in the running uh for NASA to decide who who would develop the landers. And uh it was about a five-year effort from the beginning through several contracts and and uh building a team of hundreds of people in my company and and hundreds more, you know, probably a thousand people across the country supporting our our efforts. Just a fantastic opportunity and experience in that worked with so many great people and uh you know obviously the mission is really exciting but um unfortunately we didn't win. We had two opportunities uh really to to uh to be selected and we weren't selected either time. And when you have such a project that is such a um you know motivational exciting you know one of those things where you're excited to get up in the morning and go work on it. It's it's it's hard to lose and and for me it was really kind of uh devastating in that I had, you know, been planning this is going to be my career for for the rest of my career. I'm going to be working on building the lander and then hopefully sending people to the moon and um and it just didn't pan out. So, as I'm in the process of recovering, you know, finding myself another uh project to work on and also finding new projects for for the hundreds of other people that we had on it, um I started working on this book, not at the time connecting it to that experience, but as I really got into writing it and particularly when I had made most of the progress on it and kind of looked looked back, I realized that that experience had a lot to do with how I thought about these values and in particular how I thought about um failure and what failure means and and and a big piece of what I got out of that experience was that failure is okay. You know, I I uh like most of us, I I grew up thinking failure is is a problem is, you know, failure is not an option is a is a phrase that uh was learned in in aerospace and you know, rocket science and and you kind of take that to heart, but truly failure is how you learn. Failure is how you grow in many many times and many ways. And for me, that's that's been true. So, it very much was a a big motivator. um in how I wrote the book and and then how I got out of writing the book.[Music] Do you know the real reason half your employees are looking to leave? Untrained firsttime managers. You need a way to stop the bleeding, the expensive cycle of disengagement and turnover. It's time to flip the script from surviving to thriving. Let's equip your leaders to build engaged, loyal, and profitable teams. Sign your leaders up for our six-week new manager boot camp. A hands-on accelerated program to grow and learn with like-minded peers augmented by personalized coaching sessions. No theory, just simple tools that Golden Mean Consulting co-founders Sonia and Jason have used for over 20 years. Ready to invest in your team's success? Secure your spot now at golden means consultinggroup.com/services. That's g o ldemeultinggroup.com/services.[Music] Yeah, thanks for that that recap. I mean, we're talking about this convergence of you having this failure when you thought you were going to be working on something for the rest of your career and handling that and maybe the light bulbs that that set off along with this idea that you always wanted to uh to write something for your children. I I haven't personally read all of it, just snippets, but it kind of reminded me of um Niko Maki and Ethics if I think Aristotle wrote that for his son if I understand correctly. Okay. And then and then also um you know in the book you talk about how kind of being you know midlife or turning 50 or so and all these things you know coming together and and inspiring you to to write this book in in a winding pathway as you also point out it it's not the way you planned it necessarily but we're going to get to these five um unconditional values that you you point out. Uh but before we do that, I wanted to bring up something that you write you write about early in the book and you talk about the world today and how you suggest that the challenges of today aren't necessarily uniquely complex or difficult compared to those of the past. And I think a lot of people would differ just because, right? And maybe it's recency bias or whatever you would like to call out, right? But I really want to get into that a little bit because I'd love to hear what makes you draw that conclusion and why should that matter to us that our challenges today aren't necessarily unique or special. Right. I um that that really that point was really important to me to write about in the book. and and and as you um as you read through the book, there's a section in each one of the chapters about answers and timeless wisdom. And and what I realized as I kind of went back and looked at what other people have thought about values. You mentioned Aristotle, but there's, you know, lots of others. There's Ben Franklin, and there's, you know, all kinds of more more modern authors. But as you as you go through you know religion uh religious doctrine and you go through um secular doctrine, philosophy and all these things the same values come up over and over again in response to whatever problems people are having. And and really when you kind of step back and look at it, yes, technology evolves. And so the way our problems manifest changes based on the technology, but just just as technology creates issues, it also creates solutions in many ways or creates new ways to to deal with those issues. So when you kind of strip away the things that are unique to a particular time, the the fundamental the the problems are the same. They're very very similar. And therefore the the values that are most effective in dealing with those issues end up being the same. And and that's really why I call the values timeless because you can find discussion of these values and how important they are, how crucial they are throughout history again in religion and in philosophy and in lots of different places, popular culture even throughout history. But it's um but we often miss it because we feel like we're in this unique time and and it's going to take a unique solution to deal with it. Um I remember thinking many times during the co epidemic. how tired I was of hearing the word unprecedented because you know all the time we say well this is unprecedented that's unprecedented and yeah it's true that today is different than any other day that's ever happened in history but most of the things that happened to us one could argue all the things that happened are very similar to things that have happened in the past so I was comforted honestly to realize that the lessons that we should take from those who've really thought about it. From Aristotle to William James to Steven Cvy, they've been thought through in times of struggle and times of challenge. And those things still apply. And that's really what I tried to put into the book is what I think are the most important values that have come out of all of those um struggles in the past. That's a brilliant framing. Thanks for the explanation. And I think it's very clear to everyone who's listening and I love the word that you chose comforting. You know, we think we are facing novel challenges and perhaps as you called out, they're novel in in in its particularness of it. That's fair. However, there's comfort in thinking that there are near limitless resources to draw upon that you can leverage, right, to solve or or or face whatever we're we're dealing with. And I think that's a really brilliant way to think of it. If I recall from the book, I think you said something like we're not where we are today is not the um what was it? It's not the culmination, right? It's the accumulation, right? And that's just like a things clicked in place in my brain to see them in a different way with that line. So, thank you for writing that. Hopefully that lands for people. We're gonna talk about as much as we can these five unconditional values. You know, how does it all work together? You know, we'll just scratch the surface a little bit. Sure. But for everyone listening, uh again, the unconditionals, five timeless values. You just referenced timeless values again in your last response. They are love, gratitude, integrity, accountability, and endeavor. And we're going to start with love, which is the one that I think you say is the foundation for the other four. And here's a quote from your site uh from uh Deanna Landers, who's the founder of morning coffeebeans.com. This is what she wrote about your writing of unconditional love. And I quote, "This was the most accurate description of love I have read next to the Bible. It made me stop mid chapter many times to evaluate my love for myself and others. So, congratulations on the company that regardless of whether we're Christian or not, the point is congrats on your chapter making it into this company of a legendary book. And I think I that'll humble you, right? I think that in the book, here's what I wrote down. Here's the quote. Unconditional love requires loving all people for no reason except they are human. We may not know them or they may seem different, but because they exist, we should love them. How does this apply to leadership or being in the workplace? How does that fit? Yeah. Well, first of all, you're right. It is humbling when somebody says uh what Miss Lander said and and but but what I really felt was important and what in influenced me to make love kind of the centerpiece the foundation for all the values is it's not just the Bible. It is, you know, all religious um documents and all great thinkers of the past or at least a large number of them have emphasized the importance of love. Now, some talk about it in different ways. They refer to it as different things, but when you get down to it, love, and I I talk about it in terms of respect, kindness, and compassion, a a genuine desire for others well-being and and a desire to help others uh do well. Um that is, I think, crosscutting across history. And so um I believe that it's critical to us personally. It's crit critical to us in our relationships, but that it also has to apply in the workplace. It has to apply in our in our uh places of work and in leadership positions because it is so fundamental to us as people. And and the way that manifests in the workplace and in leadership positions is that we give respect and kindness and compassion to everybody that we work with, to the people who work for us, the people who work with us, the people we work for, and especially the people who we encounter who don't work in our companies. It's so easy. I I know because I've I've had these feelings myself. It's so easy to have a us versus them uh mindset in dealing with other companies, particularly competitors, but but it's really a a critical aspect of being able to work effectively with others and in the workplace to have just a baseline as unconditional as possible as humanly possible respect and kindness and compassion for everybody no matter who they are no matter what place they're coming from physically or figuratively. I love your answer, Andy. Um, you know, yeah, we have competitors. We want to quote unquote win or be one of the winners and all that stuff, but boy, in an industry, you'd like to think that um what's the saying? Rising tide lifts all boats, something like that, right? um that if we are all in this together trying to influence the world or society or do something great in our industry then that should still require should still demand kindness and respect to other human beings. They're all humans as you're saying. And I love it because I think, you know, love is truly may maybe the only resource we have in unlimited supply, right? Right. We can truly just choose to exercise it whenever we want. And and I love that. Yeah. Um Go ahead. Yeah, please. Well, and what's so great about love, and I think it's true of of all these values, but in particular, love is it's it's I I express this in the book in terms of how we feel about our children, but I think it's true of how we feel about everybody. You're afraid when you have your second child that you're not going to have enough love for that second child. You know, you've given it all to the first and so you don't have any left for the second, but you realize that you have an infinite amount. And so that's true with other other people. Just because you have loved ones in your family and you have friends and you have others doesn't mean you lack the ability or capacity to give more. You always have more. And the the beautiful thing about it is as you give it away, you get more back. So uh it is it is a zero a a positive sum instead of a zero sum uh value that you know the more you give away the more you get back. and more is created. And I think we're all looking for positive some things these days. There's so much anger and division, right? So, I think that's a fantastic thing to bring up. I love that. And um and also to kind of go back to what Deanna Landers said in that um in that quote about the book, you know, we're also including ourselves in this too, right? Absolutely. So, that's a big component. Yes. Um so, gratitude, unconditional gratitude is the second value. Uh each of your chapters on these five values has a different section like what it is, why it matters, etc., etc. And one of my favorites is where do we go wrong? And so when we talk about gratitude, unconditional gratitude, where do we go wrong? The two main things that I emphasize in that chapter about where we go wrong are worry and complaint. And and I really intentionally chose those two as as compared to gratitude because I think worry is a future-looking, you know, it's it's something where we can't control it because it's going to happen in the future, but we're going to um tie up our brain with with that worry. complaint is more tends to be more past or or sometimes present. But certainly another area where either we can't control it or it is uh something that may not uh need to be controlled but it it very often is past focused but gratitude in its purest form is really present focused and it's here's what I have and I'm going to appreciate what I have. you know what I have, who I am, uh where I am, I will appreciate those things for what they are and try to do so unconditionally, no matter what the circumstances. And there are so many beautiful examples. I I I chose a couple for the book, but there are so many out there of people that you just never would imagine could have a deep level of gratitude because they've been through so much. They've they've suffered so much. But they are the ones who show gratitude closest to unconditional of of most of us because because they have shed those u burdens of having to worry about all the things that they could have knowing that what they have is already wonderful. Being alive is already wonderful. So, uh the the getting the bogged down by worry and complaint in particular tends to uh be very conditionally focused. And if we turn to unconditional gratitude and appreciate what we have, it's so much more fulfilling personally. Well said. Thanks for that, Andy. I mean, so yeah, we're trying to find a way where we're not complaining about the past or worrying about the future, but mindfully engaging and appreciating the present. And I think that's well said and and something that can benefit any of us. Um, unconditional gratitude, a wonderful thing to strive for. Uh, your third value in this book is um, integrity. And this is more of I mean, I'm trying to pick a variety of different types of questions for the different values. And here's and you definitely I have to agree with Deanna with with her testimonial that or her um review in that you know definitely certain things in this book have made me think a different way. Mhm. So you point out in during the discussion of integrity that it's that honesty and integrity are different and I don't know that I have honestly no pun intended there that I had thought about this before. So could you explain to us what's the difference between integrity and honesty? Sure. Uh, integrity is, I think, the hardest one to wrap our brains around of these five values because we use it in so many different contexts and and and somewhat loosely. But when you re really look at the initial core meaning where the word comes from of integrity it it is tied to it has the same root as the word integer from from math which means whole like a whole number and integrity really means wholeness. It means being consistent and whole and complete. And it does absolutely include honesty. But so often we equate honesty with integrity. But integrity is more than that. Integrity is being consistent in our thoughts, words, and actions all the time or or striving for that all the time. Being consistent in private and public. um being authentic, in other words. Um being fair, you know, having loyalty when you when you say you're going to tie yourself or connect yourself to supporting someone that that you do that. And and then what really kind of stands out is is often when we show moral courage, when we have this feeling of what we want to do and we have the courage to do it in even difficult circumstances. So I think what makes integrity more than just honesty is that it's about wholeness. It's about being consistent and whole and aligned with who we want to be every day. Um no matter what's going on. Yeah. Well, and that's what makes something unconditional, right? Is it doesn't waver Absolutely. doesn't waver in the face of external factors. Right. Right. Yeah. I I mean I definitely learned a lot from that chapter and and I'm kind of uh going back to the word comfort. I'm kind of comforted that you say that one is perhaps the most challenging because for me I was like okay all right this sounds extremely hard and uh you know you always want to think that you will do the right thing when no one's looking you know but hey we're fallible uh so right absolutely um but yeah wonderful value thank you unconditional integrity um I think accountability the fourth one is one that a lot of people can relate to in business we talk about being accountable for something accountable for your team, accountable for results, profit and loss, whatever it is, right? Um, but you do have a nice um framework for um accountability, a path to accountability. Can you step us through that? Sure. Fundamentally, accountability is about owning it. It's about when we have a duty or obligation, responsibility, we recognize that and we own it. And so the framework has to start with acknowledgement. Acknowledging that you have an obligation, a job, a duty, whatever it is. So starts with a uh acknowledgement. Um and and I should should have started by saying it's the first four letters of accountability. So acc the the personal framework, but um acknowledges first and then the second uh C is consequences. And that means think about what the const consequences could be. You you've got a duty or you've got a a job to take care of and um you recognize that uh what you say or or do is going to have consequences. So you think about those, but then you've got to get then move on to the next C, which is complete. You complete whatever it is. And that's certainly the the thing that we all have to work most on with accountability is is actually following through and completing whatever it is we've signed up for. We've got to be reliable. And that's such a key part of accountability. And then finally, the O is own. And and the key part of that is to to make it unconditional. You have to own whether it's good or bad. Whether the results are positive or negative, whether they're good for you or bad for you because the job is yours. The the obligation belongs to you. You have to own that outcome. And it accountability ties really closely in with with integrity, with endeavor, with all of them. But it means if you own the outcome, then you can grow from whatever happens. and and that ties into some of uh the part of endeavor. So um that's the framework uh acknowledge consequences complete and own and I think those are the key steps to really being accountable. Is there one of those points in the path that you think as people were most likely to fall down? Um I I think it depends on the person, but I would say um complete, you know, that that's that's the the crux of of accountability and and complete is you actually follow through all the way through the end of whatever the task is. I think that's like when I'm talking to my kids, you know, it's uh if you're washing the dishes, that's your job for tonight. You know, it's not just you wash these dishes here, but you got the whole thing and you actually complete the complete the full task. Um but but I think there are also people who don't think about the consequences. They don't think about hey that the outcome may not turn out the way I want and I have to be able to accept that. So think through the consequences know what could happen but you still have to complete the task even though it might not work out the way you want. Yeah. Thanks. I think that I I definitely um follow the complete part. I mean it's it's always um for most people it's always alluring to start something new right and and kind of leave the last 8% of something unfinished or not you know closed out. Um uh I think um very simple framework the way you outline it. So thank you for that accountability ACCO acknowledge uh consequences complete and own. Wonderful. Thank you. And for those of I I haven't said this outright yet, but I definitely recommend this book to anyone listening. It's it's a great read. It's an investment. I'm not you know there are a lot of ebooks that are shorter these days, okay? So you it is going to take time. However, it's probably better to read fewer books deeply than it is to read a lot of books shallowly. So just to say that it's a great read. A lot of epiphies happening for me looking through the text here. Um, let's get to the fifth value. Um, and I again with this one too, I don't think I ever thought of endeavor as a value. We just talked about conditionality versus unconditionality. How do we let conditionality get in our way of in the pursuit of endeavor? Right. I certainly appreciate that. um you don't hear of endeavor as a value very often and and I'll be honest I struggled with should it be one of the values you know how is it one of the values how should I talk about it I came down on the side of including it um because I really think for us to live in the world we have to act we have to strive we have to do you know you can be an aesthetic and and and live on a mountain somewhere and and maybe what you're doing is not endeavor per se, but I think if you're in the world, you're you're living and you're you're you're doing. And I called it endeavor because there are so many pieces of it that I really wanted to call out. Effort, you know, is a critical piece and and and maybe for some people that is the piece, but it's got to have purpose and and it's got to have, you know, attitude. It's got to have some of the other things that I talk about. And then the critical aspect is that you end with growth. So conditionality tying into endeavor is if we don't at least try to have these different aspects and and again starts with purpose and it has effort and preparation these key aspects. If we if we are halfway going about say preparing for an endeavor and we don't want to take that on fully, we're likely to fall short in the endeavor. If if we don't give our full effort, you know, when we we go halfway on that because we're just not willing to uh to try hard. um or or if we're not willing to persevere, uh we we hit a roadblock and we just we're going to stop there because it doesn't feel good. Um though all of those things are conditional and and that means we're not going to achieve the results that we'd like to achieve in in that endeavor or or certainly we're not going to grow which is really the key part uh in that endeavor. So conditionality I think in in how we act and how we do is just as uh just as important to keep in mind and to try to avoid by being unconditional as with the other values. Yeah, there's that theme of of completeness again kind of we talked about it in accountability and now you're speaking to it in endeavor um and the goal being growth at the end of the line which is I mean I spoke to someone uh earlier this season uh Don Schmeanka he's at MIT and stuff and and his latest oh okay his latest book is just about failure you know and and it's funny because you can't truly fail I suppose unless you you go through the full endeavor and you gave it your all and then you look back right Yeah, you certainly don't get out of failure what you could if you don't go all the way through, right? You can fail by just quitting, of course. True. But the growth here, but you don't grow out of that. So, I think one of the biggest impacts on me by writing the book was I don't know if it's a realization or just a reminder, but of how important failure is to success. Failure is a stepping stone. It's not a it's not a roadblock. Yes, it may be an obstacle to completing the task in the way that you had planned, which I think is kind of the way Don talks about it. You know, you're you've got an expected way this is going to turn out and it doesn't turn out that way. You know, maybe that's a failure, but you learn that you can't do it that way and you have to do it a different way and you grow from that. So failure is is really a prerequisite for the growth that we need. Yeah. Brilliant. Um before we get to the wrap-up portion here, I have one last question for you. And um you know, we talked about unconditional love kind of being the foundation for the other four values, but really the superpower element from your title, if I read it right, you know, it's it's putting this all together. And there's a a quote in here that you have to your children. It says,"To my children, if you embody all the values in this book, you'll be among the best people in the world. If you strive for most of them, if you usually strive for most of them, you'll be a better person than I. There's a heaviness to this though, Andy. So, I ask you, you know, for people who are listening this, they're grocking all of this, they're like, "This sounds fantastic, but holy crap." Right. What's one piece of advice you could give to them to begin this journey of living more unconditionally without feeling overwhelmed or like they're having to push a boulder up a hill? I'd say first of all what I mean by superpower is not that you become a superhero but that you stand out first of all you're you're different than you were before you in individually you have made progress you've grown and you stand out from who you were before and then and then secondly if you're really striving for one or more of these values on a consistent basis and making progress slowly but surely, you're going to stand out among other people. And that's really kind of the definition of a superpower is standing out. You know, people look at you and say, "Wow, what what does that person have going on?" Um so so superpower isn't uh isn't intended to be you know wearing a red cape but it's but it's intended to be um becoming better and better better than yourself previously and also in a way that people will recognize and how to do that. I think yes, it's hard. These are these are big goals, but it's it's always, as with any good goal, a step-by-step process. So, you say this is a value that I struggle with. Maybe it's integrity or maybe it's accountability. I struggle with this. I'm going to take one step and let's say um it's integrity and and I'm struggling with being consistent, being the same person, you know, at home and at work and in my relationships and and that's where I'm struggling. So, I'm going to decide I want to be a person who's consistent and what do I need to do to become that person? And then I'm constantly going to be working on aligning myself in my thoughts and my words and my actions with that type of person. Um and so taking one step in the direction of unconditionality with one of these values is I think um it's still hard but it's it's something all of us can do. And by doing that, we we are aligned with the people we want to be and therefore we eventually become more of the people we want to be. Yeah. Again, very comforting and encouraging. Thanks for that response, Andy. I appreciate that. Before I get to the last question I always ask everyone on Leadership Voyage, um where would you like people to go if they want to connect with you or check out the book or or elsewhere or otherwise? Yeah, the easiest way is just go to andycrockerbooks.com. Uh you can connect and find the book in all its formats. It's pretty much available everywhere and in all the usual formats, but uh but there's a single link there that'll take you to all those so you can choose what you like. You find out more about me and uh certainly I invite you to connect with me. There's a way to do that on the website or you can do so on LinkedIn or some of the other platforms. Perfect. And that'll be in the I'll be in the show notes to connect with Andy. So everybody, you can check that out. Great. Um, so I ask everyone on this show the the same question at the end. So in about uh 60 to 90 seconds of time, Andy, you have uh what what's something that you've learned recently? I love communicating with other people about things that I strongly believe in, like having written the book and these values, but I also am reminded of how much I love hearing other people's reactions and hearing their own perspectives. And so, just honestly, the opportunity to be on your podcast and and and other opportunities to speak to people about the book has reinvigorated me. uh frankly um and I've really enjoyed that. So again, not a revelation maybe, but certainly a reminder that uh that I I enjoy that so much and just talking about issues like this are so important. It is so important. And yeah, thank you for sharing the wisdom that you've uh you've found so far in your journey with everyone. And I like I said already, I encourage everyone to go out and check this book. So uh thank you so much for sparing your time, Andy. Uh it's really been a joy for me. Jason, thank you so much. I really appreciate it.[Music][Music] There you go folks. If you never heard uh a conversation with a rocket scientist who just lost to Elon Musk and Jeff Bezos, now you have. And we got to talk about why he wrote this book and a lot of the contents within. So yes, Andy Crocker was inspired to write The Unconditionals earlier earlier in his life, but he didn't really get around to doing that until more recently when a few things happened. One, he failed in getting this contract to get to the moon. Uh his oldest son was ready to graduate from high school. And third, he kind of reached this midlife point um and wanted to share wisdom that he saw and how these pieces all came together. And I think that's one of the themes in this season of Leadership Voyage is a lot of folks really wanting to share and help others find great results, which is what I admire about all these folks who are taking the time to talk. So, as we've heard uh kind of in detail, his failure in the human landing project is what led to the realization uh that he should write this book, but also this idea that failure is okay. and someone who's in midlife and mid-career you know kind of having that epiphany that failure is okay and that is where growth happens we love that and Don Schmanka talked about that uh in depth right earlier in this season with his book winners and losers as well says the challenges we face today are not new are not unique I almost did it new unique New York right our challenges are almost uh are not unique today they kind of how they manifest test themselves. Sure, of course, it's it's specific to this time, but um we can find comfort in that similarities have come up in the past and that there is timeless wisdom to draw from, right? It doesn't answer all your problems, but there is this limitless supply of of resources that you can use to look at how you have to face the world, which is fantastic. So in the book the unconditionals right he talks about these five unconditional values love gratitude integrity accountability and endeavor we talked about love it does apply in the workplace we're talking about treating everyone with respect right even competitors and the great thing about love you have an infinite supply it applies to yourself you get more when you give it all these great things we talked a little bit about gratitude and how you know you can go wrong with this in terms of looking back or looking forward and that generally manifests itself as worry or complaint. Integrity comes from the word integer. I did not know that. And it implies whole. It's more than just honesty. Talking about accountability as a value. Um he has this acronym ACCO. Acknowledge consequence, complete, and own. We talked about that. And endeavor, which I thought was an exciting one. Something I hadn't really thought about as a value. It's pretty a pretty unique concept here. You need effort, purpose, attitude, and growth. and you have to get all the way to the end if you want to grow even from a failure in that endeavor. Um, failure is a stepping stone to success. It's not a roadblock. And I think that's one of the great learnings that uh Andy called out today. So, I hope you enjoyed this conversation as much as I did. The book is uh it's deep. It's a lot a lot to it and it's worth the time, but uh yeah, it exceeded my expectations uh from when I picked it up. So, I definitely encourage you all to check it out. Go to his site in the show notes and see what you think about The Unconditionals. Until next time everybody, take